5 HN users recommended this commentary6 months2021–2025score 6
Years with an HN recommendation, 2007–2026
Cited repeatedly in e-bike threads as a well-argued safety counterpoint from someone who rides both.
FortNine argues that e-bikes have injury rates and speeds closer to motorcycles than to pedal bikes. It argues riders should treat them with similar safety gear and caution.
“Fortnine made an excellent argument against the safety of ebikes, worth watching as a rebuttal to this article” (HN, 2021)
The youtube motorcycle channel Fort Nine makes a pretty good argument that the risks of ebikes are similar to those of motorcycles, and the riders typically have less protective gear. [this video]
Argues e-bike risks resemble motorcycles with less gear.
Came here to say this. Bicycling is absolute madness to me in any location that doesn't have dedicated separate bike paths. You are maximizing all possible sources of risk by riding a bicycle on shared roads. I've ridden motorcycles since I was 16, and everyone always sees me as the daredevil. Yet, I still think bicycle commuters are the true madmen. Zero protection, can't keep up with traffic, your very presence is a psychological irritant to motorists which causes them to wish you harm, etc. But don't take my word for it: [this video] My only advice to cyclists: put your bike on your car's bike rack, take to a bike path and enjoy. If you want to get on a road on two wheels, buy a motorcycle and wear every piece of protective gear you can afford. You (and your family) can thank me later.
"E-bikes’ identity crisis might seem like the symptom of a transition" The identity crisis is that they are electric motorcycles/mopeds pretending to be bicycles. Here's a good video on this by someone who has both an e-bike and a motorcycle.[1] He points out that for his commute in traffic, they get about the same performance. But on the motorcycle, he's more visible, has better protective gear, and has a lower center of gravity. The difference between a class I e-bike (20mph, no helmet required) and an electric motorcycle capable of 45 MPH is a switch. The trouble is, e-bikes with motorcycle speed capabilities lack motorcycle safety features. They're under-braked, under-tired, have crap suspensions, don't have full lights and turn signals, and the rider is up too high, so accidents are worse. There's a video of someone who put an e-bike motor hub in a small motorcycle frame, which got him something that's a better e-bike than most e-bikes, but is classified as a motorcycle. But low-end electric motorcycles have not caught on in the US. Bikers think they're uncool, and bicyclists think they're uncool. They're popular in parts of Asia. So, yes, there is an identity crisis. [1] [this video]
Compares commuting on an e-bike versus a motorcycle.
That's a US definition pushed by the E-bike industry.[1] The EU has a completely different classification system.[2] Anything above a US class 1 e-bike comes with more restrictions. Good E-bike vs. Motorcycle discussion.[3] [1] [link] [2] [link] [3] [this video]
Motorcyling channel Fortnine did a video in depth on this topic: [this video] (They've also done some more motorized cycle and electric content lately. A recent video showed how to rebuild an old motorcycle's frame into an electric motorcycle using a kit.)
Someone who is into both e-bikes and motorcycles has a good answer to this. He put an e-bike hub motor with a motorcycle-sized wheel on a motorcycle frame. The result has about the performance of a class 3 e-bike, but it's a better vehicle.[1] You sit lower, so the CG is lower, and if something goes wrong you tend to slide, not go over the handlebars. You have motorcycle-grade tires, brakes, and suspension, so the stopping distances are much shorter than with an e-bike. But you can't take the thing in a bike lane. And it requires a motorcycle license. [1] [this video]
> The bill defines “low speed conveyances” in Colorado law. These are small profile, low-speed vehicles that people use for transportation and recreation, including bicycles and electric bicycles, electric scooters (not including mopeds), and wheelchairs. I think including electric bicycles in this is unwise. In a typical commute, they average the same speeds as motorcycles: [this video]
Cited for e-bike commute speeds matching motorcycles.
I think there's a solid argument that e-bikes are essentially motorcycles lacking a variety of safety gear. That may be an advantage where you can ride e-bikes on dedicated bike lanes, but is probably a disadvantage if you ride e-bikes on roads shared with cars. They lack the speed to match pace with cars, forcing passing, and they are more prone to being hit from the side, since e-bikes tend to ride on the right side of the lane and drivers underestimate their speed. [this video]
Supports claim that e-bikes are motorcycles lacking safety gear.
> Came here to say this. Bicycling is absolute madness to me in any location that doesn't have dedicated separate bike paths. You are maximizing all possible sources of risk by riding a bicycle on shared roads. > I've ridden motorcycles since I was 16, and everyone always sees me as the daredevil. Yet, I still think bicycle commuters are the true madmen. Zero protection, can't keep up with traffic, your very presence is a psychological irritant to motorists which causes them to wish you harm, etc. > But don't take my word for it: [this video] Whatever one might think about the general premise, but this video is absolute rubbish. All the little example videos he puts in is of people riding on crazy tuned e-bikes or downhill bikes etc.. On the other hand the few instances of motorcycling videos show him just riding along in traffic, a bit disingenuous. > My only advice to cyclists: put your bike on your car's bike rack, take to a bike path and enjoy. If you want to get on a road on two wheels, buy a motorcycle and wear every piece of protective gear you can afford. You (and your family) can thank me later. Considering that the article points to bike paths off general roads your post is a bit redundant. I would still question your premise. You ride a motorbike beside the fact that motorcycle deaths and serious injuries outstrip cycling ones by quite a margin (it's right there in the video you posted). So I guess safety is not your main priority. Moreover, if we consider overall healt
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